You are hereIf Big 12 goes bust, KC could still boom with holiday hoops tournament
If Big 12 goes bust, KC could still boom with holiday hoops tournament
If the Big 12 Conference goes bust and Kansas City loses the Big 12 postseason basketball tournament, there is no reason Kansas City’s local college connection between Kansas State, Kansas and Missouri would have to go bust with it.
The Border War football game between Kansas and Missouri could be played as a non-conference opener to the football season.
But Kansas City would then have a real opportunity to keep the local economy booming by reinstituting the fondly remembered Big Six-Seven-Eight (Christmas) Holiday Tournament in basketball.
Starting with the Big Six Tournament in 1946 through 1978 when the Big Eight staged its final December men’s basketball tournament in Kansas City, all Wildcats, Jayhawks and Tigers gathered in our town to play some basketball against their conference mates and each other.
And the action was transferred to the poker tables for coaches like Jack Hartman of K-State, Norman Stewart of Mizzou and Joe Cipriano of Nebraska.
As a young reporter I remember sitting in on one of those card games myself and I can still hear Jack and Norm ragging on each other and Cip blaming a bad run of cards on “Helmets! Helmets!” Cip was one of the few Nebraskans who genuinely hated the football program. Likely out of jealousy.
In this anticipated rendition, Kansas State, Kansas, Missouri, Nebraska and Iowa State could serve as yearly participants with three non-area schools invited to Kansas City for three days Dec. 26 through Dec. 28 in the Sprint Center.
Four games the first day. Four games the second day, split into championship and consolation brackets.
Two games the third day: the championship final and the consolation final.
Every team guaranteed two games. Four teams making the championship or consolation finals playing three games.
Would people hit the Power & Light District for the tournament run. My bet is yes, and hard?
That is my memory of the old Holiday Tournaments I attended as a child with my dad and later as a reporter for The Star.
Whaddayathink?
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Missouri is deluded if it thinks it'll play an invitational basketball tournament in KC or football games against KU/K-State or Big 12 opponents. Why would KU or K-State want to give the SEC a presence in fertile recruiting grounds? Nebraska won't be played either since they're in the Big 10. Duh?
The Big 12 Tournament can still be played in KC. KC is in the Midwest not the Rust Belt or where the good ol'boys in the SEC break recruiting rules all the time.
Get over it Mizery! The Border War is over and Mizery has lost.
no way is ku going to play mu anymore if you and missouri decide to squirm awasy to the SEC. hell i wouldn't even play in the sprint center anymore since it is in missouri. also now way all those end of season tourneys are coming to kc. alot of the attendance at those things is local. no way can people afford to go to even to a few of them. plus being in hutchinson,ks there isn't anyway the juco tourney is leaving.
The money people in this town are looking to bring in additional revenue to KC. If anyone thinks they're going to let any petty jealousies get in the way of making money, including the schools involved, is crazy.
They'd actually lose money. Gotta get the basic concepts down here, fella....
The role of the media during this entire process has been an absolute disgrace. I was hoping our local reporters would be more responsible.
Mike, aren't you getting enough of your slant in with your "reporting?" I'm embarrassed for you.
My bosses aren't.
I'm glad you have so much time to respond to comments in between calling, and vetting, your many "sources."
Happy to respond to a valued reader for noting my contributions and tireless efforts on your behalf.
Payday for KU? Puh-leeze. KU makes more money by hosting home games than they would at this "tournament". How is Sprint Center going to draw enough fans to compensate KU for losing 2 home games over this time frame? They can't Mike. Get a grip on reality.
Unless you want to pay KU more than the other schools to play. Which makes sense given they are easily the biggest draw. No KU fan wants to see them play Nebraska, or KSU/ISU whom they'll play soon afterwards anyway.
Finally, quit deluding yourself that MU's local presence will be the same if they leave. It won't. The local media will rapidly lose interest covering them, and KU-KSU-ISU alums in the area will stop caring about MU as well. Cutting out the Arrowhead game with KU for good....that's just one example.
MU wants to stay in the Big 12 partially to keep KC in their corner as a large alum & fan base.
Typical arrogance - thanks for perpetuating the stereotype, stinkey. While I would agree, if KU, KSU and ISU are still in the same conference, this might not fly. However, the idea has merit. And don't worry about MU's local presence and/or coverage. I would rather see the Big XII heal and go forward, but if MU moves on, KC fans will follow.
From the MU fan here. So, all pettiness aside, just answer the simple question: "What's in it for KU?"
If you can't really answer that --- and nobody can based on any real logic --- then KU won't play in it.
If KU isn't in it, it won't exist. Make sense?
I look at the potential demise of the conference as an opportunity for Kansas City to establish itself again as a national basketball destination instead of just regional. In short, we should seek to host every postseason tournament that is not the NCAA Men's and Women's Finals or Men's NIT Finals and on as permanent a basis as possible to make Kansas City the true College Basketball Destination in March. To be more clear Kansas City should seek to become the permanent home for the Women's NIT, the CBI Finals, the CIT Finals, the National Juco Mens and Women's tournaments, the NCAA Division II and III Men's and Women's Tournaments and the NAIA Division II Men's and Women's Tournaments. Can you picture Bartle full of basketball courts with the Semi's and Finals being at Muni and the Sprint Center? Kemper and the American Royal Center could be used as well if they are still around. It could be a full month of wall to wall basketball!
I like the idea of going for more tournaments, but I don't think the women's NIT, CBI, CIT or JUCO tourneys would have the benefits you expect. I can't imagine the championnship games from either of those would fill the Sprint Center, or even Kemper Arena. You'd have a bunch of half-empty games between UNC Asheville and Pepperdine. If Kansas City wants to become a destination, they would need to try DeArmond's Holiday Tournament idea, plus make the CBE bigger. Instead of bringing 4 teams to KC, bring 8. Also, make a bid to host the men's NCAA every year if possible, plus the women's tournament as much as possible.
If you are talking about 1st round games through regional finals I agree. The tournaments I'm suggesting might not bring the crowds individually that an NCAA Tournament would bring but if you layered them collectively and made up some unique ticketing options you could get players, coaches, staff, fans, friends and family who are in town for one tournament attending the other tournaments while the teams they came to see are not playing. Plus coaches and administrators conventions could be held at the same time. By the time all is said and done these events could match or exceed the economic impact of losing the Big 12 Tournament and that is what we are talking about replacing. KC ought to already be going for 1-5 round NCAA Tournament games and every round of the Women's NCAA Tournament.
Screw MU. They can't have their cake and eat it too. If you leave you leave.
MU would be a persona-non-grata if they ever really pulled out of the conference. And as such, would never be rewarded the opportunity to play the old core. Particularly Kansas.
Logically, there'd be no incentive for the local schools to keep MU's presence in this market. Surely you're not dumb enough to miss this obvious fact. Of course, MU would love to keep KC as a fan center, and recruiting base. Nada.
But more than anything: KU has nothing to gain from playing MU in Sprint Center. If they have no trouble beating MU in Columbia, there's little point pounding them down the street in KC.
And you are naive if you think that Kansas State and Kansas would turn down the payday that this would generate.
It is about dollars and sense, not ego and nonsense.
is accurate but he is right about this. KU wouldn't play MU if MU left the conference. KU is the biggest draw in the KC market and there would be no reason for KU to share the market with MU. I don't think the money would be a big draw either. KU can schedule a couple of games in the Sprint Center against about anyone and sell it out. Why help out a potential recruiting rival in the area.
We may never know so this is merely an entertaining conversation. I agree that during the basketball season KU is the biggest draw in KC. But that is not any kind of exclusive right. KU doesn't control the market, it just dominates it.
As for the money being there and being worth it: In the early years at least the city of Kansas City would very likely have an interest - in keeping its hoops culture alive - of lining up a sponsor who would guarantee Missouri, Kansas and Kansas State enough money to make it pay.
And I also believe you're underestimating the drawing power of the three local schools and Iowa State in Kansas City as a collective unit.
As for recruiting, I haven't seen Bill Self worrying about being out-recruited anywhere by K-State or Missouri recently (or ever). Nor should he.
Bill is a big boy. I'd contend he would welcome playing K-State and Missouri in Kansas City rather than Northeast Southwestern University of the Plains and Mountains just about anywhere.
Just my opinion, however.
If MU blew up the conference. That is just my opinion as well but I don't think it would make any sense to play them.
As for the money, I think you are missing the fact that KU already plays Northeast Southwestern University of the plains and Mountains in Sprint and it sells out. Actually is is usually someone like Colorado State but you get the idea. KU can schedule whoever they want at Sprint and not have to split it with a tournament field.
MU is going to create a great deal of animosity in the area if they blow up the conference and I don't see the schools they leave behind being willing to help them out in any way. I could see KU/KSU at Arrowhead replacing the Border war and I really don't see any reason why KU would play MU in basketball.
P.S. I think there is less than a 10% chance MU goes to the SEC so this probably is just an exercise in hypotheticals.
What some fans think and what is reality don't always match up. None of the games you mention generate the interest from $ponsor$ you might think, and the true fans get bored seeing those no-contests. People want to keep the football and basketball rivalries going and they will continue, whether within the conference or not.
going, they best not leave the Big 12. If they want to....as the poster said above..."Have their cake and eat it too".....ain't happening.
In life, you never reward bad behavior. And that's what KU would be doing if we kept any contact with you post-conference. Something to chew on.
KU would make more money playing Tennessee school for the nervous in Sprint Center than playing in a tournament in the Sprint Center where they have to split the money. The sponsor money wouldn't be the same but the sponsor money wouldn't be split 8 ways either.